Many of us have an interesting relationship with alcohol. What is it that brings us to drink. How did it become so normalized in our lives. Today we are going to talk with someone who decided to take a look at his relationship with alcohol.
Hey everybody, this is Chris Brandt, here with Sandesh Patel. Welcome to another FUTR podcast.
Today we are talking with Scott Burton who has had a complex relationship with alcohol throughout his life. This inspired Scott to take a look at his history, creating a hybrid documentary called Earnest Drinker, that asks the questions, why do we drink and why we stop. He takes a look at the spectrum of alcohol use and its normalization.
So let's talk with Scott to hear the story of making this documentary
Welcome Scott
Earnest Drinker: https://earnestdrinker.com/
Click Here to Subscribe:
FUTR.tv focuses on startups, innovation, culture and the business of emerging tech with weekly podcasts featuring Chris Brandt and Sandesh Patel talking with Industry leaders and deep thinkers.
Occasionally we share links to products we use. As an Amazon Associate we earn from qualifying purchases on Amazon.
Many of us have an interesting relationship with alcohol. What is it that brings us to drink. How did it become so normalized in our lives. Today we are going to talk with someone who decided to take a look at his relationship with alcohol.
Hey everybody, this is Chris Brandt, here with Sandesh Patel. Welcome to another FUTR podcast.
Today we are talking with Scott Burton who has had a complex relationship with alcohol throughout his life. This inspired Scott to take a look at his history, creating a hybrid documentary called Earnest Drinker, that asks the questions, why do we drink and why we stop. He takes a look at the spectrum of alcohol use and its normalization.
So let's talk with Scott to hear the story of making this documentary
Welcome Scott
Earnest Drinker: https://earnestdrinker.com/
Click Here to Subscribe:
FUTR.tv focuses on startups, innovation, culture and the business of emerging tech with weekly podcasts featuring Chris Brandt and Sandesh Patel talking with Industry leaders and deep thinkers.
Occasionally we share links to products we use. As an Amazon Associate we earn from qualifying purchases on Amazon.
Many of us have an interesting and oftentimes poorly understood relationship with alcohol. What is it that brings us to drink? How did it become so normalized in our lives? Today we're going to talk with someone who decided to take a look at his relationship with alcohol. Hey everybody, this is Chris Brandt here with Sundish Patel. Welcome to another future podcast. Today we're talking with Scott Burton, who has had a complex relationship with alcohol throughout his life. This inspired Scott to take a look at his history, creating a hybrid documentary called Earnest Drinker that asks the questions, why do we drink and why do we stop? He also takes a look at the spectrum of alcohol use and its normalization in our culture. So let's talk with Scott to hear the story of the making of this documentary. Welcome, Scott.
Scott Burton:Chris and Sundesh, thank you guys so much for having me on your show. It's a really, it's a real honor.
Chris Brandt:Absolutely. Well, it's a, it's, it's exciting to have you here. And this is a topic I think that is so very relevant because I can't tell you it, you know, like both in my personal life, I've, you know, in my family, we've dealt with a lot of alcoholism and things like that. But I think, In our professional lives, we see, you know, the impact that alcohol has on a lot of people. Um, yeah, and you know, I know one of the things you talk about in the documentary is sort of the normalization of all of that. So, you know, we see a lot of people struggling and, um, I, I, so, I, I, that's why I'm really interested in, in the documentary. Um, but. I want to get started with, you know, kind of understanding, you know, why you, it was important for you to make this documentary and like, what is your history with alcohol?
Scott Burton:So I think like so many Americans, uh, I started drinking when I was 14, um, and I drank until I was 44. So a good 30 years of drinking. That's a good long stretch. Right. And it. Yeah. It was so natural for me to start at age 14. Everybody in my family drank. All my friends in high school drank. That's pretty young, though. Well, yeah, but everyone was doing it. You know, it seemed like the thing to do. James Bond drank in movies and he was... And he looked cool. He was sexy. There were booze commercials on the Super Bowl. You know, and that's the normalization, right? In our country, it's more normal to drink than it is not to drink. You know, there weren't commercials in the Super Bowl like, Hey, it's cool to be sober and hang out with your friends. Which, I know Sundish was doing that, by the way, in high school. With, you know, my wife, Brooke Monroe. And I'm, like, they're kind of my heroes. I don't know how they did it, but they just hung out and like, Played board games and did cool stuff while I was off just getting hammered. Hi, I'm Scott Burton, a documentary filmmaker. My collaborators and I are making a one hour film titled Ernest Drinker. It's about people's relationships with alcohol. And this is our crowdfunding ask you for money video. Sixty five thousand dollars. What's your relationship with alcohol? If it's like mine, it may include Fun times! Depression. Inspiration. Anxiety. Just one more. Drunk driving. Confidence. Dysfunctional relationships. Unwinding. Addiction. Sexy bar scenes. Erectile dysfunction. Dinner parties. Shitting your pants. Cocktail hour! Denial. I jumped into bed with alcohol at age 14, and we've been loving and fighting for over 30 years. We finally separated in January of 2020, and I have some questions I'm hoping to answer in this documentary. What is an alcoholic? What's a functional alcoholic? Should we be using terms like alcohol use disorder? What stigmas are attached to words like alcoholic, sober? And, you know, drinking and driving. It's a miracle I survived, um, deeply ashamed of drinking and driving, by the way, uh, when I was younger, uh, 40 years. And then, so I stopped on January 4th, 2020, and I just have so many questions about it. You know, I guess for those 40, 30 years, excuse me, um, I was what you would consider a functional you know, drinker, whatever, uh, did well at work, mostly got some awards, um, made a living, that kind of stuff. Um, but as I look back on it, um, there are so many things I could have done better. So many relationships I could have handled better. So many things. That alcohol sort of adulterated over that time, and so I, I really with this movie, I want to challenge that word functional, and so many of us who think we are functional drinkers, I challenge you to really examine your relationship with alcohol like I am, um, and see how functional you really are. It's
Chris Brandt:interesting. I mean, you talk about how unusual it was for Sundance and Brooke to. Not to be participating in all this and to be kind of separate from this and I, you know, you're right when you say it's so normalized. We're expected to drink. I mean, when you're younger, especially, you know, it's like, what do you want to do? Let's go out to the bars. Let's go drinking. Let's go do this. Um, Even, you know, today in a professional context, let's go grab a beer. Let's go. You know, it's like it's it is central to socialization. And I think in some ways to like, uh, men tend to really leverage it to socialize as well.
Scott Burton:Definitely. And, you know, one of my Fears as I stopped drinking, you know, around three years ago was, am, am I still going to be funny or can I still talk to people or how am I going to socialize? And, um, here I am, let me, let me get the dates right. So if it's January 4th, 2020, I guess here in 2024, that will be, will that be four years? You guys help me with the math. I'm an English major. Yeah. Okay. So pushing four years. Yeah. Yeah. And so I, you know, how, how am I going to talk to people and, uh, come to find out like I am funny and I can talk to people that said, um, you know, I learned from a friend of mine once. She said, yeah, I used to drink to be extroverted. I was like, what, what do you mean by that? She's like, well, I'm an introvert, but if I drank, I could be an extrovert and talk to people and be the life of the party. And I realized that was a big thing for me too, because at my foundation, I'm an introvert too. I definitely would drink to be extroverted and, uh, and I could be the life of the party and funny. These days, uh, I'm finding myself as an introvert, um, and I enjoy smaller gatherings. I'm still funny and quirky and goofy and Silly and stupid, all those things, but, uh, it's me, it's, it's, it's who I am, and it's not augmented or modified by alcohol, which is something I'm really coming to appreciate. Yeah, I mean,
Chris Brandt:I look back in my, my, my days of, you know, drinking and, and, you know, going, going kind of wild and, um, I, I think I had a very, uh, different impression of myself than what probably the rest of the world did. When I was doing that, and I think that, um, because I don't drink, I haven't drank for, you know, many years now for various health reasons, um, but I don't enjoy being around people who are drunk as I used to be at those things. So I gotta imagine. I was also similarly insufferable, right?
Scott Burton:That sounds like a country song in there somewhere. I don't like being around people who are as drunk as I used to be.
Chris Brandt:Well, there's definitely some truth to
Scott Burton:that. It's interesting, you know, and I think, um, I'm sure at some point you're going to ask me, you know, what are some of the challenges with this? And one of the challenges is not to sort of proselytize about how great it is not to drink like, Hey, you guys shouldn't drink. It's so great. And I think I shared with you guys earlier, I'm trying to make this movie for the 30 year old version of me. Like what could I have said to me at age 30? Well, even 14, what could I have said to that 14 year old kid? You know? Um, And if I had just said, drinking's bad for you, and, uh, blah, blah, blah, I'd have been like, you know, give him one of those, um, give me one of those. And, uh, and so I'm trying to make a film where I'm not proselytizing about people, because I have, like, you guys, I'm, I feel like I'm thriving. I feel so good, I'm healthy, I've lost weight, I'm better at relationships, uh. You know, like the list goes on and on. It feels so good. So how can I not, you know, when you got you like, you're like, I'm, I'm into meditation. So you want to tell everyone about meditation or you found this great show on Netflix, you want to tell them about it. So I found this great new thing. And how can I make a movie that doesn't, you know, jam it down people's throats. So that's one of the challenges I'm having, um, and trying to take an equitable, yeah. Look at alcohol, um, an objective look at it. Here's the other tough part that I'm still figuring out is like, I had a ton of fun while I was drinking. Yeah. Could I have had that fun if I was not drinking? I think the answer is yes, but I did have a ton of fun and I had a lot of experiences with a lot of friends that I really value. And like, side note here, um, sometimes I feel like some of my friends that may still be drinking or, uh, that I have memories with as drinkers. Just because I don't drink anymore doesn't mean that I discount any of those memories or those friends like I'm I may be in a different space now, but those are all memories that we made and I cherish those friendships and and and that time
Chris Brandt:you're you live in Alaska, right and and I and I understand that the documentary is to some extent focuses largely on, you know, your experiences in Alaska and with other people and their experiences in Alaska, but it's, you know, a more universal concept than all that. But, I mean, why in particular Alaska?
Scott Burton:It's just the place that I know. Um, you know, I'm lucky enough to live here on Tlingit Ani, uh, Tlingit territory in southeast Alaska, um, here in what's also known as Juneau. And, um, I've lived here for over 20 years, so this is as close to a home, I guess, as I've ever had. This is the longest I've ever lived anywhere, so it's the place I know the best. And the older I get, I realize the stories that we can tell the best are the stories that we know, right? Or the places that we know, um, the experiences that we know. So this, Alaska happens to be the story that I know. I think anyone who sees the trailer, um, or who sees this film, really, it could be anywhere USA. So I'm going to use statistics, you know, for example, one statistic that I share a lot from Recover Alaska, uh, who is also supporting this film, Recover Alaska, thank you so much. Um, alcohol misuse, Costs Alaska 2. 4 billion a year.
Chris Brandt:Yeah, I'm surprised it's not even higher than that when you think about all the things that
Scott Burton:could go into that number. Yeah, and that's what, you know, some people say, and that's a conservative estimate. 2. 4 billion a year it costs our state. You know, dig around, do a Google and, and see how much it costs your state, um, or how much it costs our nation. You know, I'm sure there's a flip side to that too. There's people who work at breweries and distilleries and it makes, it can make great jobs and stuff like that. And so the, nothing's black and white, um, right, but, um, that's a big cost to our state. That's a lot of money that could be going towards education or, yeah. I mean, Alaska
Chris Brandt:has long, long dark winters and, you know, people in places like that, you know, there's often a lot of alcohol use associated with that too. So I gotta imagine there's some really interesting stories that came out of
Scott Burton:there. Yeah, that's true too. Um, so yeah, I just, you know, I've, like I said, I was lucky enough to, I'm lucky enough to live here for over 20 years. So it's a place I know. I worked, um, for various NPR affiliates, uh, for close to 10 years and was able to travel across the state and build relationships with folks. And, um, now I'm able to use some of those relationships, um, and that experience to make this film. And I just feel so lucky to be able to do it. Um, I think I shared with you guys, this whole project started at, started out as an essay. And the essay's title was My new sober powers in the tavern, in the tavern of life, and that's, it was, it was okay. I admitted, I, um, admitted it to This American Life, but they didn't take it. Uh, but that's, you know, that's a big bar. Yeah. Um, anyway. I was, I was doing this essay and I thought, man, I really need to interview a bunch of people and I need a lot of information, a lot more information for this, um, piece. And then I'm like, well, if I'm going to do all that, I might as well make a film, you know, let's take a camera and audio with me and, um, and so that started, you know, that's how the film. Got going about two years ago. Um, yeah, almost two years this fall, by the way, it's going to be coming out this fall. Um, and, and, uh, you know, the other thing I thought too is, um, I, you know, I, it was hard to find financial support for an essay if you write a really good essay and somebody publishes it and, or, uh, you know, you eventually publish it. Maybe you can make a living off your essay as a writer. And I also wondered, you know, as a filmmaker, yeah, This is a way to find financial support and that's also been really helpful.
Chris Brandt:Yeah, I think you know, it's Film has has a different kind of audience that people I think are more ready to Donate money into that cause right?
Scott Burton:Yeah, and a big thanks to all the crowd funders out there and Organizations and foundations that have been helping me out couldn't do it without
Chris Brandt:you. I'm sure you've learned a lot of about You know, drinking and alcoholism and alcohol in general through this process, um, you know, what, what are you coming to in the sense of like, why is alcohol so problematic for so many
Scott Burton:people? You know, one of my interviews is with Anna Bayliss, and she's a behavioral health person up in Seward, Alaska. She's been doing this for a long time. She's a person in long term recovery, um, who now helps people, um, and she, you know, she talks about alcohol as addiction. Um, alcohol use, misuse as addiction and how alcohol use, uh, changes our brain chemistry and causes us to be addicted to the substance. And so, she speaks very eloquently to that. She'll be speaking to that in the documentary. And, um, You know, that's one of the thing I'm thankful for is this, this whole pack. If you go to the website, earnestdrinker. com, you can see all these people I've had the honor of interviewing and they're going to be adding their professional perspectives about addiction and, and alcohol use. Um, so I love having their voices. involved with this. Um, but yeah, why is it, why is it so problematic? You know, I guess all I can speak to maybe at this point, Chris, is my experience. And so, man, it was a problem from the beginning. Like it was fun. You know, I would, I would drink alcohol and laugh and with my friends and, and have a great time. And, but then I would drive home drunk, you know, like I, I lived in Portland, Oregon as a teenager and I would go over and party all over Portland. And then like, drive home really drunk across the bridges of Portland, Oregon to get back to my house in southwest Portland, like, that was a huge problem, like somehow I never got caught, and somehow I never hurt anybody else or myself, and so for me the problem started right away, except I, I was ignoring it, right? Like, I didn't realize that drinking and driving was a problem. And so, I mean, can you imagine what would have happened if I had hit, you know, a family or something? Like, and, and that's one of the things I want to look at with this documentary too. Um, by the way, I think of documentaries, for me, my work processes, I think of this as like a, a research paper. Remember those in college where you'd like ask a question, how does alcohol affect us? And then you just. Do you research and you answer all these? That's my question. How does alcohol affect us? Kind of sort of. Um, and so I'm, I'm looking for all these answers anyway. If you get caught, if I had to hit a family, God forbid, or something when I was 14 or I guess I couldn't drive till I was 16. If I had to hit a family. I would have been labeled as a person with a problem and funneled into treatment, and my life would have changed dramatically and all of that. If I'd have gotten caught, I would have been a person with a problem. I was never caught, so I didn't have a problem. What's that, right? Like, in effect, it was chance. That said, I didn't have a problem, I, by chance, I didn't get caught. Um, so that's part of it, and that's a really interesting concept for me to look at. And then, the other question is, the social equity of punitive measures associated with alcohol. Did I never get caught because I'm a privileged white male? You know, like if I'd have been a person of color drinking and driving all around Portland, would I have gotten pulled over, uh, would I have gotten caught and then, you know, had a problem with alcohol? It's a lot more likely, right? So looking at social equity, uh, as well as something I want to look at in this doc, um, and then, yeah, how's it affect us, you know, different people, I think genetics have something to do with that. I think our home lives, whether your parents are drinkers or not has a lot to do with it. You know, who teaches you. to drink or not to drink if they show you what moderation is, I didn't know what moderation was. Um, so I, I think those are some of the answers, but I know there are a lot more than that. I think it's
Chris Brandt:true of a lot of, um, drug use and, and, you know, the use of illicit substances and things like that, that there's underlying it. In a lot of cases, it's sort of a sense of hopelessness, right? And I mean, if you look it back, you know, so those rats on cocaine or rats on heroin studies that they used to do and, you know, the ones that, that, that, you know, just gave it all up for cocaine or whatever. I mean, if you look at their lives, they made their lives particularly bad in these overcrowded cage conditions and things like that. But if you kind of took those rats and repeated that experiment in a more, um, idyllic rat world, I suppose. Um, they didn't have the same kind of outcomes with it. So it, it seems like there's, there is a little bit of a, you know, like we are humans in a world that, you know, wasn't really, was designed by us, but not built for us in a lot of ways, you know? You know, our way to adapt to that, you know, falls short and our, uh, social anxieties and, you know, integrating into society and things like that all, you know, really reap havoc on our psyche.
Scott Burton:Yeah, it's so complicated. Yeah. By the way, and, you know, when I first started making this doc, I wanted to... I was like, I, I need to come up with the answer. I'm going to solve all of this with my documentary. And now I'm realizing there's no way to solve this hundreds, thousands year old relationship with alcohol. There's no way to solve it. But I think even what we're doing here today, having a conversation about it and talking about normalization, uh, talking about stigma, uh, as well, um, talking. Just about objectively talking about our relationships with alcohol, you know,
Chris Brandt:you mentioned stigma there and in, you know, at the end of the day, I mean, this is a mental health challenge and, and, you know, we don't really, um, Have a real disease oriented perspective towards, you know, how, how this all plays out. Um, and I think, you know, with this, a lot of the stigma is related to, you know, um, You're, if, if you fall prey to this and if you start having problems with this, right, you're, you're, it's because of your own moral failings or your own internal weaknesses. Right. But it's, it's, it is bigger
Scott Burton:than that. And that's that stigma thing. That's why it may sound a little hokey. But when I call this earnest drinker, a film about relationships with alcohol, I'm trying to just stay objective as I can. The minute, like even if I say I've been, I'm sober for almost four years, The minute I say the word sober, there's baggage attached to the word sober, like, oh, you must have had a problem, so you've stopped.
Chris Brandt:Well, I, when I, when I mentioned, I don't, I haven't drank for years now and you know, I find myself catching myself and you know, it's like, well, it's not because I had a problem with alcohol. I just like had other issues that, you know, made me choose to stop drinking, you know, but. I, in my back of my head, I kind of want to make that distinction, right? Because of the stigma. Right. And I shouldn't feel
Scott Burton:that way. There's a bar around here, and there's a sticker in the bar that says rehab. Uh, rehab is for quitters or something like that. You know? Right, right, right. Um. And just the word alcoholic, you know, um, even that has so much baggage and stigma attached to it. So, again, you know, a film about relationships with alcohol is just getting us to objectively describe how we interact with alcohol and how we have interacted with alcohol for our whole lives. Um, and really, you know, I, I would, if especially for those out there who may be, you know, who are listening to this podcast or watching the podcast, like thinking about the, again, the functional drinker, really looking at the choices that one makes while drinking. You know, do you ever drink and drive? Uh, do you ever get snappy with your partner? Are you ever hungover and not a good parent? Are you, uh, a little snappy with your coworkers because you're hungover? And by the way, these are all things from me. These are from experience. These are all things that used to really happen with me. And so, all those little micro, I don't know, aggressions or micro problems. you know, really add up. They did in my life. And so I'm just encouraging as many people as possible to really look at those and take away the normalization and, and pretend for a minute that it's more normal not to drink than it is to drink. Which I think is, is real, right? Like, we're not born drinking.
Chris Brandt:I gotta imagine that after having talked to all these people, there's like, are there common threads that sort of emerge from this?
Scott Burton:At the risk of proselytizing, all the people that I meet and, you know, I... hesitate to use the word recovery community for those of us in the recovery because okay, I guess we're recovering, but again, that word recovery has so much weight to it. For those of us who have chosen not to drink alcohol anymore, all the ones that I've met are thriving. We're happy. We have, we have great relations. Well, I don't, there I go, hyperbole and, and, uh, it's going to be so great. Stop drinking. Your whole life's going to get better. Don't worry. Okay. That's not true. But most of the people that I meet. Uh, are more in touch who, who have chosen to stop their relationships with alcohol seem to me to be more in touch with who they are. And it seems to me that, like, that's our all our goal in life, right, is to figure out who we are and get comfortable in our own skin. Um, it's very rare that I've, I don't think I've ever met someone's like, God, I wish I drink again. Like, I really miss being hungover.
Chris Brandt:I'll say that, like, since I don't drink anymore, I do feel like I get left out of something Because I think that, um, You know, people, it's like, oh, we're just going to pop down to the bar. We're going to, and you know, sometimes I'll go with them, but you know, it's a lot less fun being at a bar when you're not drinking, you know, and you're with people who are drinking, right? Um. And, and so it is a bit of a challenge and like as a, you know, older guy who, you know, doesn't have a whole lot of friends left anymore because, you know, I, you know how that goes, but no, but I mean, seriously, my, my wife is much better at maintaining relationships and my, you know, like in my, my relationships. tend to, you know, have historically revolved around like going out and having a few drinks, you know? Um, so, there is, there is a little bit of a sense of loss that I feel like I have from that. Well, it's because drinking's
Sandesh Patel:fun. You know, that's the one, uh, you know, my I hate my own relationship with booze, you know, trying to drink less and less these days. At first, when I started to try and drink less, my expectation was that I'd say, Man, I don't miss the booze. It wasn't that fun anyways. And the reality is that that was not true. That I actually do enjoy it. And that I, I like it. I like the feeling of it and I like the confidence that it gives me and takes away anxiety and you know, blah, blah, blah. But when I have started to look at this, what I started to do was I started looking at the The science behind alcohol, uh, and I started to do the research of what the alcohol actually does to my body. That was step number one. When I first actually started to hear, uh, on these podcasts, what is happening inside, I'm like, I'm thinking, wow, the impact on my brain. The impact on my, uh, digestion, there's just in my, my anxiety, my stress, there's, this is all a direct result of the booze, right? And so one side you have this chemical change that is happening in your body. But then the second thing is the mental. And I find the mental unwiring is so, so, so hard. If I am. Having a bad day and I just had to work my butt off and, you know, did a bunch of stuff, got a lot done, or, uh, yeah, just had a really rough, busy day. I feel like having a drink. If something good happens, I feel like having a drink. It just seems like... There really is no time to not have a drink, you know, it's like it always seems like it's always an option and For me what's really helped five
Chris Brandt:o'clock somewhere, right? Yeah. Yeah,
Sandesh Patel:it's happy hour and and the social distancing didn't help either But I think now The, uh, the big thing is to not let my brain and my ego and my mind completely take me over because that's what's happening. It has taken over and I'm not strong enough. And even when I go out with friends, I'm in my mind, I'm thinking. I'm going to have two drinks today. I'm going to have one Tito's and soda and one red wine, and that's going to be the plan. Then I go into that situation, that first Tito's goes down so quick, right? It's like, I'm already thinking about the second one. And so those are the kinds of challenges that I have in my brain. And that's where I'm at right now is I know I want to drink less, but what does that really look like? And how do I then hold myself accountable in this whole psychological game that I'm playing in my head? Because I have a plan before I start drinking, but then once I start drinking, that plan is out the door very quick. It, you know, one
Chris Brandt:of the... I think Sun Tzu said something about that. Yeah, one of my, uh... Everybody's got a drinking plan, actually. Have their first drink, right?
Sandesh Patel:Yeah. Yeah. You know, in one of my, I talked to a yogi and he's been helping me through some of this, these conversations as well. And he said something to me that I thought was fascinating in the beginning. He's like, this is like 70 months ago. He said, it's going to be easier for you to completely stop drinking than to drink a moderate amount that you think is good enough. And I started thinking about that. And I think he's right, you know, to have a relationship with alcohol. It's much harder than to have no relationship with it. I don't know, Scott, if you have any comments on that.
Scott Burton:Well, Sundesh, you just shared so many really cool things. Um, thanks for all of that. But yeah, just, um, when I was drinking, I could not imagine my life without booze. Like I used to joke, you know, people would say, you know, I'd be like, yeah, I'm a functional drinker and there's no way I can't drink. I mean, I really believed that. I would have put money on it. Um, and, you know, paradoxically, my drinking was causing my anxiety that I had every night. To start drinking again, it was just this circle of anxiety, drinking. Um, now that I don't drink, I can't imagine drinking again. It's so weird. Like, I don't, I, I mean, if you'd asked me eight years ago, Are you going to be a person who doesn't drink when you're 47? I would have said, no way. This is part of my life. It's part of my culture. I'm a drinker and I'm fine. And now I can't imagine the opposite. And so I think you're yogi. Has something there, Sundish, um, for sure, and I think it's just drawing that line, and this is so funny because the older I get, the real, I'm trying to get away from binarism, right? Like, in life, there's so many gray areas, and so I really try and avoid black and white looking at anything, but this might be one of those things. That one just needs to stop. And anyway, for me, Sundesh, it's worked so well. And I can't imagine the flip side of that. Chris, I want to back up to something you said, and I just want you to know, I'll be your friend. You said you don't have that many friends. I'm in, man. Anytime you want to hang out, I know you're in Chicago, I'm in Juneau.
Chris Brandt:That's good. I need it. I need a, I need a friend, you know, I mean, no, but I mean, it's true, you know, as you get older, you become more and more isolated, right? And the not being able to go out and drink with everybody or not the desire not to go out and drink with everybody does become more.
Sandesh Patel:I think there's also this undercurrent that's happening in our world right now, where we talk about mental health, which really to me means stress, anxiety, and depression. You know, that's, you know, those are becoming very ubiquitous in every county in, in America, if not the world. Right. So what is the real problem there? For me, what I have learned is through meditation and. different practices. I've been able to lower my stress and as I've been able to lower my stress, I've been able to think more clearly. And then when I'm thinking more clearly, I don't, I don't feel like I need that drink. And I feel like There's so many people like what Chris said early on in this conversation is in our profession, Chris and I are in the technology industry and specifically on the sales side of things and entertaining clients and things of that nature. You have numbers you got to reach, you know, you're either a winner or a loser. If you win, then everyone loves you. If you lose, you're down in the dumps. And there's just, there's just so much, uh, anxiety that comes to this job that that's why it's so acceptable. That, oh man, having a bad day, this sucks, boom, booze is the answer, right? And so I feel like almost for me has been, instead of going straight to the booze, I am trying to manage my stress, which is It's inherently just helping
Scott Burton:me drink less. And again, I think if it's, if it's similar to me, if you're similar to me, Sundish, then it's slowly unwinding that circle of anxiety and you know, the alcohol as a depressant causes anxiety and stress. To go back to something you said, Sandesh, is about is like, why do we drink and is it the stressful job? Is it, you know, there are all these things in our lives and all of our lives are so infinitely different and we have such different backgrounds, you know, what is it that may want us to drink? And, you know, I think for each of us, we have to find that answer. And part of why I feel like I'm doing so well these days also has to do with like therapy. You know, it's not just me not drinking, but I have a great therapist. I'm exercising, I'm eating well. Uh, doing a little meditation, you know, all of these things. I'm getting older, you know, I'm 47 now, um, so it, you know, the, the alcohol is, is part of this, the, the lack of alcohol, but there's a lot going in, uh, to keeping this guy healthy these days. A lot of people and a lot of community support and my amazing wife, Brooke, as you know, Sundish, um, So, there's a lot to it, and I think, you know, what is the recipe for each of our wellnesses? You know, we have to just keep looking for that and finding it, but I'll tell you, you know, again, not to, not to proselytize, but I, the alcohol thing, man, I, I swear. It just does not help, especially, I think, for a lot of us. It's
Sandesh Patel:not easy, but
Chris Brandt:it's possible. Yeah. I know that you had said that, you know, in talking through your own challenges, right, you had a different perspective after the fact. And when you, you saw yourself in the fun time you had, you know, you, You talked a lot about that with your friends and you socialize that and then everybody's having a good time, but then there's another side of that, right, where it's like the sober perspective of that, where, you know, there's the hangover the next day, there's the, you know, this, so, you know, we have a tendency to see the side that's the fun side, but we don't really talk a lot about the bad side, and even when we do talk about the bad side, sometimes we sort of romanticize it. Oh, so all over, you know, Um, but there is a downside on
Scott Burton:the other side, right? Yeah. I have a friend from college. Uh, you know, I was in a fraternity that was known for drinking and partying. Um, and, uh, there's a person in my fraternity, um, who saw the trailer. for this film on Facebook and got a hold of me after all these years. And he's like, dude, this looks so cool. I'm a person who's been sober for, you know, close to 20 years now. And, uh, this is an amazing film. I'm so glad you're doing it. And he and I sat and talked on a Friday night for an hour and a half catching up. And it was really wonderful. But I asked him this question, and this is a really big question for me. And I don't know the answer yet, and maybe you guys can help me. Um, but I asked him, I said, if you could take it all back, and this is a guy I partied with and had so much fun with in college, or I thought we were having fun, I said, if you could take it all back, without even hesitating, he goes, yes, I would take back every drop of alcohol I've ever drank. I feel like I wasted college. He's like, I wish I had made more interesting friends. I'm like, oh, damn. I was one of his friends, right? I could have made, you know, maybe more interesting friends or been doing more creative stuff. There's so much I could have been doing with my life that I wasted being drunk, you know, and being hung over. And that question, if I put it to myself, Scott. You know, would you take it all back? Would you take back all this drinking and all these fun times? Would you? And I have so many memories that are ensconced in alcohol use. And I don't know the answer for me. I, I,
Chris Brandt:I can answer that one pretty easily. I would say that... Um, there's definitely some that I would love to take back, just some like really poor choices and behavior and things like that that I would love to take back. That said, there's a lot that I wouldn't want to take back. And it's not just with alcohol, it's with other things too, because, you know, those were experiences that made me who I am and they did, you know, good or bad. You know, there's stuff that that, you know, made me understand the world a little bit better too, even though, you know, they had unfortunate outcomes in some cases as well. But I,
Scott Burton:it's a partial for me. Good answer, by the way. And that reminds me not to be a binary thinker. You know, there were some experiences that were good and some that weren't. Yeah. So if I
Sandesh Patel:can give my perspective, my short answer to that is, uh, as of right now, I would not take back my, uh, any of my experiences with alcohol. And the reason why is because I truly believe that everything happens for a reason. And so if I didn't have that experience, good and bad. Lots bad too. If I didn't have those experiences, I don't think I would have appreciated, um, where I am now and where I'm going. So to me, it's more about, okay, now you understand it. You've made mistakes, but now you're learning from those mistakes. And maybe you would have never learned if you didn't make those mistakes in the first place. And so I like to think about it more from that perspective and see any kind of crises that come my way. It's just something that was just meant to be, and there's a lesson learned in it for me. And if it never happened, you know, it didn't happen to me, it happened
Scott Burton:for me. Another good answer. Geez, you guys. With your permission, can I use this stuff in the documentary?
Chris Brandt:What can people do to help you with this documentary? I know you're still raising some money. You're still looking for some people. Can you talk about what, how people can help out? You
Scott Burton:can start by going to earnestdrinker. com. That's a good place to start. Watch the trailer. Um, right there you'll see like a little four minute video that sort of explains, you know, the things we've been talking about. So check that out. And if you want right there, you can click on a link and it's a tax deductible contribution if you want to support the film. Um, I've been fortunate enough to raise about 50, 000 so far. Uh, the budget's 218, 000. So do the math. It's still got a ways to go. Um, all right, we're going to, we got
Chris Brandt:to get everybody out there
Scott Burton:to donate any angel investors. If you guys happen to know any angel investors, uh, please send them to earnest drinker. com. Um, and that will, you know, help me hire more artists and people to be. Um, associated with this film here in our community. Um, so that would be great. You know, if you have a story, I am trying to keep us focused on Alaskans, but if you have a story and you're not an Alaskan that really resonates, go to earnestdrinker. com and, you know, just go to the contact. My email is all there and let me know what your story's like. Um, you know, maybe we, maybe you need to be a part of this film too. You have a great
Chris Brandt:opportunity, you know, even after the documentary is done and it's released to create some community around the documentary as well. I mean, I think it'd be great for you to build that community for people to share their stories. Right. Good
Scott Burton:and bad, right? I've been talking to some folks around the state about touring with it, um, maybe to other places as well, but touring with it or doing screenings and again, just. Just creating, um, dialogues, creating discussion, people talking about their relationships with alcohol, and, um, you know, a lot of us too, you know, may have experience with families, uh, that have, you know, relationships with alcohol and talking about that, and, um, yeah, I think the less we feel alone, the better. And, you know, this, in this, uh, in our relationships with alcohol, the more we can learn and, and progress. I just got to say,
Chris Brandt:thanks so much for coming on, telling us about your documentary. I think it's going to be really interesting. I cannot wait for it to come out. Um, we're going to have to, you know, like be there for the red carpet premiere, you know, wherever that's going to be, probably somewhere in Alaska.
Scott Burton:Can you fly the future jet? The private jet? We'll fly the future
Chris Brandt:jet out there and, and, and do a big. Big, uh, press junket.? Yes.
Sandesh Patel:Junket. Yeah. Right now it's manufactured by Mattel Toys . But, uh, once, uh, once we get that thing fired up, we'll be there.
Chris Brandt:Thanks so much for coming on, Scott. Uh, it's great work that you're doing, I think. Um, it's gonna be really cool to see and, um, excited, excited to see the final product. Thanks so much. Yeah.
Scott Burton:Chris Sun Dish. Thank you guys so much for your time. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for your listeners and viewers as well. And, uh, I'll be in touch. Thank you. All right,
Chris Brandt:everybody go donate so they can get it done. Thanks for watching. I love to hear from you in the comments. And if you could, please give us like, think about subscribing and I will see you in the next one.